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labradored
Dogsey Junior
labradored is offline  
Location: East Devon
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11-02-2011, 10:06 PM

Advice on re training rescue lab

hi all
im hoping some of you out there could give me some inspiration to help me train some undesirable behaviour out of my beautiful black lab. He has two main behaviour problems.....the biggest.....Food stealing (as with many labs) and secondly harassing other labradors by trying to hump them. He is a rather stressy and anxious character so would prefer positive training techniques

heres his history.....a stray, rather skinny, was unneutered but has now been fixed! (he was 18 months approximatly when in rescue kennels and neutered very soon after we took him on).

and his daily routine now consists of ...coming to work with me every day, and kongs wheneva left alone, 3 half hr walks a day at a minimum also twice weekley training. agility and obedience.

his food stealing is his biggest issue by far...he is very good with me and my partner as he has learnt we will not respond to him being pushy for food but has not generalised this to other people and will really push the boundaries, he is also super quick and know when people are not concentrating so also a very bright scallywag! he literally snatches food, this is worst at training with people that have treats in hands and treats left lying around every where my reactions are super quick now so he rarely gets to eat the treats but will always still give it a try. at home im able to manage the food situation by putting food away, we have a locking bin and he gets sent to his bed whilst we eat our dinner but hes not learning anything by me just managing it....what would you guys do...train an incompatable behaviour perhaps? your ideas would be great.
thanks xxxxxx
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ClaireandDaisy
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12-02-2011, 08:16 AM
You don`t say how long you`ve had him?
I find it takes a couple of years to turn round a dog that has been allowed to learn bad habits.
Is he toy oriented at all? Maybe you could encourage an interest in toys and play to replace his desire for a passing hot dog?
It`s difficult when a dog has once gone hungry or been starved. They do see food as a matter of life or death.
My Shamus was a stray and he would hoover anything - even chewing gum stuck to pavements but after 3 years he`s a lot better. I do have to keep an eye open for discarded kebabs though.
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labradored
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12-02-2011, 12:24 PM
ive had him for nearly 3 years now, hes not massivly toy orientated....he had to learn to chase a ball when we first got him and hes still not very fussed about having a game of fetch..having said that there is one toy he does go wild for which is one of those honking soft duck toys but im not sure that even the duck will win over a crumb of food though lol! but its always worth giving it a go. thank you
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mistygrey
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14-02-2011, 09:37 AM
I sympathise - our whippet is a HUGE food stealer and will even be at it minutes after eating a whole bowl of food. She even licks the dishwasher - yuk! All food has to be pushed to the back of the counters or she will scoff anything she can get at. It's exhausting!

We give her a simple command and as little attention as possible when she trying to steal. She is getting better as she seems to realise she isn't getting attention or the food but we still have to be super observant.

She is not interested in having a kong - she would rather have what we are having! Needless to say we never ever feed her from the table.

I would also be interested in other strategies. We are first time dog owners so not hugely experienced!
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wilbar
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14-02-2011, 10:49 AM
I agree with ClaireandDaisy ~ for dogs that have been starved, or kept hungry or gone short of food, sometimes food becomes sooooo important in their lives that they have learned lots of strategies to get whatever food they can. And the longer they practice these food scrounging activities, & the more successful they've been in the past, the more difficult it is to change these behaviours. Even when the dogs is getting sufficient to eat & is a healthy weight, obsession with food is such an ingrained habit, that they'll still try to grab what they can, when they can ~ they never know when they might be hungry again!!

To change the outward behaviours means that the dog's perceptions have to be changed. It's not easy to train an incompatible behaviour as the opportunity to get food will completely overshadow whatever you try to train. Your dog has to learn that food isn't in short supply, that it will be fed regularly with all the food it needs to remain healthy. That doesn't happen overnight!!

The best you can do in the meantime is to ensure that there are NO scavenging opportunities at home, i.e. make sure no food is left out, bins are secured, & if necessary, keep him away from you when you're eating. I would recommend that you make sure he has his own meal before you have yours, so there's no danger of him being very hungry, and then having to wait till you've eaten.

If the problem seems to be worse at training classes because the opportunities are higher to steal treats that are left lying around, the perhaps have a word with the other owners & explain, that the more times your dog successfully steals something, the more he'll keep trying. So ask nicely if they could make sure their treats are not left around, or perhaps take your dog away from the others while training?

One of the things I found that helped immensely with a very thin dog I once rehomed, was to switch to a raw diet that included raw meaty bones. The act of chewing, knawing & tearing at the bones, & the time it takes them to eat the bones, can produce a lot of satisfaction for the dog, plus, if it takes so much longer to eat, the chances are that the food will reach the stomach & turn off the satiety hormones, by the time it has finished eating the bones.

On the plus side ~ he should be very motivated to learn, if food treats are given as rewards, & if he's the smart dog you say he is, then use this to your advantage
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smokeybear
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14-02-2011, 01:41 PM
TBH Food stealing is what most dogs with a healthy appetited will do in my experience, REGARDLESS of upbringing! Having a labrador has just raised the odds of it!

Environmental management is the key, and consequences for humping.

As he is castrated this behaviour is merely an inappropriate reaction to over arousal when playing with other dogs.

Just make dogs less exciting and put him on lead the second he starts.
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labradored
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16-02-2011, 09:40 PM
Originally Posted by wilbar View Post
I agree with ClaireandDaisy ~ for dogs that have been starved, or kept hungry or gone short of food, sometimes food becomes sooooo important in their lives that they have learned lots of strategies to get whatever food they can. And the longer they practice these food scrounging activities, & the more successful they've been in the past, the more difficult it is to change these behaviours. Even when the dogs is getting sufficient to eat & is a healthy weight, obsession with food is such an ingrained habit, that they'll still try to grab what they can, when they can ~ they never know when they might be hungry again!!

To change the outward behaviours means that the dog's perceptions have to be changed. It's not easy to train an incompatible behaviour as the opportunity to get food will completely overshadow whatever you try to train. Your dog has to learn that food isn't in short supply, that it will be fed regularly with all the food it needs to remain healthy. That doesn't happen overnight!!

The best you can do in the meantime is to ensure that there are NO scavenging opportunities at home, i.e. make sure no food is left out, bins are secured, & if necessary, keep him away from you when you're eating. I would recommend that you make sure he has his own meal before you have yours, so there's no danger of him being very hungry, and then having to wait till you've eaten.

If the problem seems to be worse at training classes because the opportunities are higher to steal treats that are left lying around, the perhaps have a word with the other owners & explain, that the more times your dog successfully steals something, the more he'll keep trying. So ask nicely if they could make sure their treats are not left around, or perhaps take your dog away from the others while training?

One of the things I found that helped immensely with a very thin dog I once rehomed, was to switch to a raw diet that included raw meaty bones. The act of chewing, knawing & tearing at the bones, & the time it takes them to eat the bones, can produce a lot of satisfaction for the dog, plus, if it takes so much longer to eat, the chances are that the food will reach the stomach & turn off the satiety hormones, by the time it has finished eating the bones.

On the plus side ~ he should be very motivated to learn, if food treats are given as rewards, & if he's the smart dog you say he is, then use this to your advantage
im already doing a lot of the things you mentioned on the management side of making sure he doesnt get the opportunity to find food at home but yes i agree i should warn people esp new people (he has learnt new people are easy targets - see, hes smart )that turn up to class about the speed of which he can spot and steal their treats! trouble is they dont often believe me in just how foody he is (ive had two other labs in the past and they were nothing like as quick and foody as Ollie is - its his special talent!!) perhaps im expecting too much from him at the moment and i should keep him on a lead - our club lets the dogs have a 5 min off lead play before we start training and this when the time when mistakes happen you see. When we get into training mode he is as good as gold

im interested on the raw diet though and had considered this in the past to see if it makes a difference as im not sure his food really makes him feel full (mind you does a labrador EVER feel full!) its worth researching it a bit more though so thankyou! I shall read up on it

And yes he is super smart love him to bits!
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