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SarahJade
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23-08-2012, 02:12 PM

Handlers - 'drawback'

Just a discussion thread, I don't mean any offence or want to start an argument but...
On a different thread someone said that the only drawback would be the handler - I think referring to the level that a dog could reach would be limited to a handler.

Of course some dogs aren't capable of becoming the best fly ball, obedience or agility dog and sometimes it is down to the individual personality or the dogs breed, but how often is it just down to the handler...
My question is:
Do you think that your dogs ability at the areas you have developed are limited by your dog or by you?
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smokeybear
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23-08-2012, 02:15 PM
I will repeat what the late great Terry Hadley said and I believe it to be true.

If you gave me the choice between a good dog and a mediocre handler and a mediocre dog and a good handler, my money would always be on the latter.

I have seen LOADS of good dogs never reach their potential due to the lack of skills, knowledge, ability, training and experience of the owner. I have seen LOADS of mediocre dogs which reach their potential with those who are skilled and knowledgeable.
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Ben Mcfuzzylugs
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23-08-2012, 02:20 PM
I hope I am never better than my dogs, I am always learning things from them
I appreciate they put up with my mistakes and teach me to think outside the box
Will they reach their full potential?? Does anyone?? Agility is my sport but winning dosent matter, having fun and improving together as a team is what matters to me
Sure Ben wins more often than not - and that is a nice bonus - but I prefer a great fun run with poles a flying to a winning run that he didnt enjoy so much because of pressure to perform
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SarahJade
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23-08-2012, 02:20 PM
Originally Posted by smokeybear View Post
I will repeat what the late great Terry Hadley said and I believe it to be true.

If you gave me the choice between a good dog and a mediocre handler and a mediocre dog and a good handler, my money would always be on the latter.

I have seen LOADS of good dogs never reach their potential due to the lack of skills, knowledge, ability, training and experience of the owner. I have seen LOADS of mediocre dogs which reach their potential with those who are skilled and knowledgeable.
I very much agree with that, but without having Cookie I am not sure that I would have gained anywhere near as much skills and knowledge that I now have, because he is so good to turning his paw to new things that I go, ohh lets try this today.

Do you ever think that these good dogs would be better off with a more experienced handler?
I suppose I sort of worry that if Cookie had had a good handler from the start he would have been so much better challenged and happier?
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smokeybear
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23-08-2012, 02:26 PM
Originally Posted by Ben Mcfuzzylugs View Post
I hope I am never better than my dogs, I am always learning things from them
I appreciate they put up with my mistakes and teach me to think outside the box
Will they reach their full potential?? Does anyone?? Agility is my sport but winning dosent matter, having fun and improving together as a team is what matters to me
Sure Ben wins more often than not - and that is a nice bonus - but I prefer a great fun run with poles a flying to a winning run that he didnt enjoy so much because of pressure to perform
If winning does not matter, why do you enter?

If you want to have fun, surely you can do that at home, and not pay the entrance fee, travelling costs etc?

I hope I am ALWAYS better than my dogs, if I was not, they would not need me for guidance and direction would they?

Just because YOU may put pressure on your dogs to perform, does not of course mean that others do.

When you do win, do you collect your rosettes? Do you display them in your car or on your wall?

If you do then winning DOES matter doesn't it?
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Wozzy
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23-08-2012, 02:28 PM
Flynn could be an excellent dog when it comes to many things. I'm sure with an experienced handler, he would've made a brilliant gundog as he has drive, pace, style and is eager to please and biddable. You couldnt ask for a dog that is more eager. He does pretty well in gundog competitions now but my lack of experience and major errors I made in the beginning have ruined him and he will never reach his full potential. I was going to try working trials with him but his cruciate problems put an end to that thought.

On the other hand, I have a dog that has very low drive, low motivation, isnt eager to please and will never be a great dog, despite the efforts I put in. He is happy to just tootle about in his own little world at his own pace - what can you do with a dog like that? Dont get me wrong, he enjoys agility and obedience but doesnt see the point in putting in any more effort than is minimally required.

I had my third dog as an adult rescue and she had already been emotionally damaged so although she has alot of promise, she would never fulfill her potential because there are barriers in the way.
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smokeybear
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23-08-2012, 02:28 PM
Originally Posted by SarahJade View Post
I very much agree with that, but without having Cookie I am not sure that I would have gained anywhere near as much skills and knowledge that I now have, because he is so good to turning his paw to new things that I go, ohh lets try this today.

Do you ever think that these good dogs would be better off with a more experienced handler?
I suppose I sort of worry that if Cookie had had a good handler from the start he would have been so much better challenged and happier?

You learn the most from the most difficult dogs.

I do not think that good dogs would be better off with a more experienced handler, why would I?

A happy home is what is important to the DOG, what is important to the owner varies.

Why would you think your dog may be happier with another owner?

A dog does not miss what it never has.
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smokeybear
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23-08-2012, 02:31 PM
Originally Posted by Wozzy View Post
On the other hand, I have a dog that has very low drive, low motivation, isnt eager to please and will never be a great dog, despite the efforts I put in. He is happy to just tootle about in his own little world at his own pace - what can you do with a dog like that?
Not a lot.

You cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

A dog has to have SOME drive to do SOMETHING other than just exist.
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Wozzy
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23-08-2012, 02:36 PM
Originally Posted by smokeybear View Post
You learn the most from the most difficult dogs.

I do not think that good dogs would be better off with a more experienced handler, why would I?

A happy home is what is important to the DOG, what is important to the owner varies.

Why would you think your dog may be happier with another owner?

A dog does not miss what it never has.
I see where SarahJade is coming from with her comment. When I think about Flynn I always think it's a shame that he ended up with me as an owner in some ways because he could've been so much more and could be excellent at most disciplines. But then I look at it another way and acknowledge that he can be a difficult dog to handle purely because he's that enthusiastic he lets it get the better of him, and he could well have ended up being passed from pillar to post because other people may not have been able to put up with him.
So, although he may not have reached the heady heights of being a working gundog, he landed himself a forever home where he at least gets to fulfill some of what he loves doing.
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ClaireandDaisy
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23-08-2012, 02:41 PM
I think it takes two to tango. It`s a partnership - each is no good without the other, after all.
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