Thanks Carole.She is constant worry as you never know with her what is going to happen next and constantly on the look out for health problems that we can hopefully stop before they get to bad.she is only 3 years old!

"our breed is pretty much it would seem on the decline."


Boxer Cardiomyopathy (BCM).
Aortic stenosis/sub-aortic stenosis (AS/SAS)
Hip Dysplasia
Elbow Dysplasia
Cancer
Corneal Dystrophy
Juvenile Renal Dysplasia
Blood Clotting Problems
Digestive Problems
Brain Tumours
Hypothyroidism
Spondalocis
Epilepsy
Deafness



These problems can all be found in Boxers. I found this information on the internet on a database called.

'Canine Inherited Disorders Database'.

Granted other breeds can and do suffer from a great many of these problems I am not saying they aren't what I am saying is this is a heck of a lot of problems to be found in the breed we are talking about.

I also discovered that inbreeding has been the practice of Boxer breeders for the past hundred years. All of which surely has helped not preserve our breed but contributed surely to the problems it now experiences.


Cancer can and does strike down a good many dogs, even our beloved Mongrels are not immune, I have had friends who have lost dogs to this dreaded disease as well have lost friends. It sucks and if I were able I would shelter anyone from its effects in a heartbeat.

Unfortunately we can't wave a wand and get rid of the genetic ills that trouble ALL canine's regardless of their breed. If you look at each breed you will find a list of health issues that any breed can suffer from.

Boxers as a breed you list 14 Genetic disorders,
As a breed we aren't alone -
Pug 15, Mastiff 14, Newfie's 13, GSD's 13, Poodle 13, Lab's 12, Yorkie 12, Cocker Spaniel 11, Border Collie's 11, Bulldog 11, English Springer Spaniel 10, Westie 10, Bullmastiff 10.

Not ALL breeders inbreed on the same dogs, however when you realise the breeds history (orignates from a British Bulldog and a Mastiff type breed called the bullenbeisser - check the genetic ills in those pedigree breeds too) you will know that the breed descends down from a handful of dogs anyway so even if they aren't closely in-bred in the first 5 generations if you trace back far enough you will come to common ancestors sure enough. The breed itself is still relatively young only being around since 1894, first breed standard published in 1902.

Anyone that knows about genetic disease knows that there arent simple modes of inheritance for some diseases. Some will be easier to crack than others for eg Progressive Anoxapathy or PA for short. this has been eradicated from our breed through careful breeding practises.
AS - has been significantly reduced through the heart testing scheme.
However others like BCM and JKD are not so easy with the inheritance being unclear in some cases.
These are still works in progress and will require lots of money for research and donations of DNA and kidneys etc from owners of dogs to be able to move forward (the work that is done for disease in dogs can have a direct link to disease in humans for eg cardiomyopathy in Boxers acts the same as in humans - if we can find that gene in the dogs we can possibly unlock the answers for the humans).

The jury is still out on the likes of HD - the testing that has been done for years in other breeds has not seen a significant decrease in median scores for those breeds. So this doesn't appear to be the only answer here.

As breeders you have to weigh up the whole picture -
You have to have balance in the debate,

for eg would you ignore/exclude from breeding a dog that has a good heart (older generations too), no close relations that died young of any disease and perhaps may have not been hip scored - but there isn't any known problems with lameness etc in the dog or it's family.
Both parents were alive and well or lived to above the breed average life expectation.

Or would you opt to breed a dog who has been hip scored at or below the breed median, but has a grade 1 murmer for AS, some relatives had died below the breed average age due to cancers etc, there were lines that went back to at risk BCM lines etc.

You also have to realise that to keep the gene pool as wide as possible sometimes breeding comprimises have to be made. There is yet to be the perfect healthy genetically free of all disease dogs born and bred in any breed.
We are all dealing with nature and whilst the majority of breeders do strive to make the right choices with the diagnostic tools available to us, there is never going to be perfection. If there was we'd all be in line as we all want the perfect healthy specimen that will be long lived and free of all genetic ills.

I dont think this tool was available on the kennel club website when i purchased Katie but if it was, i was not aware of it.I would certainly use it IF i ever get another boxer and that "if" is a real shame as my family has had boxers for over forty years now and i cant imagine my life without at least one boxer clown it.

BOXACRAZY Thank you for your reply.
I gave your question some thought, whether I would use a dog health tested/passed in a good majority of the issues but not HD, would I use it.
Firstly I would have to say, I could never be a breeder, but if I were then I would try my damndest to find the healthiest dogs and bitches I could with which to breed from. I accept a few compromises may have to be made in some spheres, but hopefully in time I would achieve my goal of breeding a healthy dog. Healthy that is in all aspects.
Yes it may be a dream, but hey, who is to say my dream is wrong.
However, whilst I accept there are breeders out there who are trying to do their best for our breed a good many still continue to practice such terrible practices as inbreeding. Or as one breeder I came across quite recently called it 'line breeding' as if by changing the wording makes it any less abhorrent. Far more as I have said don't.
Add to this they, the unethical breeders as I shall call them continue to refuse to carry out and/or ignore the tests that would weed out the dogs with such problems as heart issues simply because, if you don't test you can use the old get out of... 'plausible deniability'.
Yesterday I watched the BBC programme on Pedigree Dogs (you tube is such a wonderful tool). On it a King Charles Cavalier exhibitor/breeder knowingly used her dog at stud despite it having the skull/brain problem one which can and is passed down to the pups. Then there was the dog that won Crufts, a Pomeranian. This dog had, had an operation to repair a defect (hereditary and most definitely passable) which surely should have meant he was not the best of his breed and certainly not the best of show. Granted the judge probably didnt know about it, but the breeder/owner did yet this dog won and whats more had sired dozens of pups before and since. To me this dogs owner is unethical and I would question if he truly loved the breed or if his love affair was with the money he could make out of it.
Now I know some will not agree with my view. I accept this, just as surely they should accept that I view our beloved breed as being so compromised because of bad breeding practices as to become very endangered indeed.

As for my seeming fixation with HD above all the other problems our beloved breed suffers from I would like to explain why this is so. I accept that there are far more important health issues plaguing our beloved breed/s than HD but as this thread is obstensibly about HD and Spondalocis I was trying to keep to topic and not stray too far in case I incurred the wrath of the administrators or something.

But you are all right when you say there are far more insiduous health issues killing our dogs before their time. I just wish that the breeders who pump out the bulk of the puppies folk take into their homes would stop and think a little more about the heartbreak they are causing by not giving the pup the best start in life as they can. The best start being, as few inherited diseases etc being passed on to the pups from their parents as is humanly possible to do.

The COI on the KC website doesn't go far enough to really assess the amount of inbreeding

I have a computer program that goes back 10 generations, which is a much better assessment of inbreeding

Some epileptic GSDs appear not to be very inbred, but when going back 10 generations or more the real amount of inbreeding/line breeding to known epileptic/epilepsy producing dogs is much higher.

That sounds really interesting,could you please tell me what that program is and where i can obtain it from?.Thankyou.

Mine is one I wrote myself with the help of a programmer friend, however there are programs on the market that do 20-40 generations

Yo do of course need access to a pedigree database to ensure yo have the correct information to input

Thankyou so much for that,what a great little tool and so helpfull to people who dont always no about pedigrees of dogs.I wish i had known about it.

I'd be interested to know the stats of the two distinct groups - of those that have hip scored (and only bred if deemed acceptable) and those that have not.

Would we see a likelihood that dogs whose parents have been hip-scored have a much lower chance of getting HD?