Hi Myra,

I must admit when we worked in Esau's weight, we switched to a specific diet food.

Not sure what you could do if you can't afford a diet-kibble . . Maybe swapping out some of his food for raw, like minced Turkey or chicken and veggies, etc? A carrot makes a great 'chew-stick' treat and is full of vitamins and minerals, almost no calories.

I would avoid eggs tho, which are actually quite high in fat.

Oh, how about adding a splash of half-fat milk or skimmed milk (goats milk is more easily digested if you can get it)? It might replace some of the nutrients he's losing, and if you soak the kibble in it, it will swell the kibble and he'll think he's getting more, tee-he!!

Myra, please don't do anything that forces Nigredo's to start running hard, in an effort to burn off his weight - you could make his hip dysplasia worse without meaning to! He may not be bad now but neither was Esau, and now he needs painkillers daily. If we'd known he had HD we could have toned things down but we didn't! You have that advantage.

Nigredo's needs to lose weight but not at the expense of increasing other problems. Recent studies have shown its actually better to constantly move about, rather than have specific 'gym time' and then spend the rest of the time sitting down - the same is true for dogs.

Try putting him on a lead and tie it around your waist so he must follow you around the house all day - he will be getting exercise, but very gently, all day long. As his weight down because he won't be so uncomfortable in heat, etc, so he'll naturally get more boisterous when out for walks or playing in the yard.

I really cant see that reducing 4 cups to 3 cups a day is the reason he is losing coat or giving off a smell, the reason he is overweight is because you have fed him to much food, so even if you have reduced it , by one cup he will still be getting the nutrients he needs.

As I have stated before its not how many cups you feed its the amount you are putting in the cups, if he is not losing any wight you are still feeding him to much.

You could try 3-4-5-6 cups a day to keep him interested just divide his daily intake between all the cups or buy one of those puzzle toys you can put food in, and let him work out how to get the food, this will also kill two birds with one stone , as he will be active while he hunts for food.

If you cant take him on long walks, then get him out 4/5 times a day with shorter 10 min walks, do something in your yard, put weave poles up or the like to get him moving in the yard, you don`t have to put jumps up but there are plenty of other things to keep him active.

If he is not losing weight and the other issues, and you have reduced the intake of food, then something else may be going on, may be best to speak to your vet. regards the low cal food, in my experience its an expensive gimmick and does not make much difference, in fact it can leave a dog hungry as its so much lower in calories , just like human diet food, your starving after you have eaten it.

Diet foods are designed so the dog still feels 'full' because they contain extra roughage, from what I understand, but reduced fats, and keep the same level of vitamins/minerals. Nigredo might need all the EFAs (essential fatty acids) he was having in 4 cups of his current kibble, and reducing the amount is reducing the EFAs, which can account for coat-condition deteriorating . . I don't know about the sleep in his eyes and doggy smell, but it could be mild allergy and again, EFAs are known to dampen allergic reaction.

Myra could try supplementing EFAs by using coconut oil or a vet-prescribed oil (I use Viacutan for Esau), but these ARE fats and so that needs to be taken into account with what is being fed . . or she could try a diet kibble.

i feel Myra is aware of the problem and is trying to solve it - she should be applauded for that, and encouraged to keep trying - not told off because what she's tried so far hasn't been successful.

Sorry, but I've been there myself and well-remember what it feels like. It took a long time to get Esau's weight down and it was hard work, it's still hard work maintaining him at a good weight! The attitude of people who just told me 'Don't feed him so much' really got on my nerves - it said they believed I was too stupid to know that for myself, or that I wasn't strong-willed enough to do it, neither of which was true.

Don't give up Myra - you WILL find a way to work this because you clearly love Nigredo to bits, and won't give up on him. It takes time to work out the right way to help each dog, it isn't as simple as 'stop feeding him so much' as you're finding out! Keep at it!

Jackie and I don't have a great history, but I appreciate her trying to help here. Don't think she is "telling me off" just think she is saying give it more time. Nigredo isn't fat only because I've fed him too much, he has horrible metabolism. My last dog was skinny his entire life, regardless of how much I fed. This is new to me. He's never had coat issues or soppy morning eyes, the food reduction has got to have something to do with this. He's perfectly healthy otherwise. I can't keep paying vets to check him for the same things over and over again. A cup is a unit of measurement. You put food in it, level it off, and there it goes. A cup is a cup, and he gets three cups. He's not a happy camper, and he's not losing any weight so we need to try a diet food. This food was too expensive itself, and frankly... I'm beginning to think the FOOD I feed him doesn't matter. But we are going to keep trying because he does have HD, which of course will only worsen and he is too chunky currently.

You've cut the diet by a quarter so stress may be a factor in the coat shedding and, at this time of year, environmental influences (ie hay fever) may account for the change in eyes.

We don't use 'cup' measurements here, but I can't see it being totally reliable when it comes to kibble as the size of the kibble will make a difference to the weight (ie you will get larger air pockets between larger pieces of kibble than smaller pieces so it could affect the actual weight of what's in the cup)

I can empathise with what you are going through as my brother had a lab who was very, very overweight. At one stage, he got down to a starvation diet with her with no difference to the weight at all. She had all the tests and she was perfectly fit and healthy. She was walked for miles every day as she went everywhere with my brother and she had a long swim every morning. She lived to be 14 when her HD finally got the better of her, but my brother fought the battle for years to try to help her.

I do hope you have better luck with Nigredo x

Thank you, though it seems your brothers dog lived a long and happy life, despite weight problems and HD. I'm glad to hear that story. I don't feed Nigredo enough for his activity level for him to be noticeably overweight. Seriously, his bowl barely has any food in it. A cup is 8 ounces. His metabolism is simply terrible like your brother's dogs had to have been. We're going to search for a diet food and see where that gets us. His coat looks bad (NEVER DOES HIS COAT LOOK BAD), I don't even want to take his picture or take him places. This ISN'T Nigredo, this is a mess!

Is it at all possible he's picked up an infection? Just a thought - loss of coat condition, gunky eyes, etc, can be a sign of a viral infection, or even mange mites! If he hasn't been de-fleas recently you could try an all-in-one flea, tick and mange treatment? Just a thought. Stress can sometimes lower resistance to mange, too!

Nope. He's parasite free. He donated blood last Thursday and they make absolutely sure the dogs are clear of any parasites or health problems. No way does he have mange. And his eyes just have corner sleep in them, where I've never seen it before (the other dog always has this, it's normal for her). He's just more sheddy etc. than is normal FOR HIM, for my other dog and my previous Labby guy, this would have not been a huge deal. I spent an hour grooming him a bit ago, and he DOES look a bit better... but his coat is thin along his spine and I suppose we'll finish this bag out and try some diet brand. Not sure which one yet though.

I wonder if this is your problem, if you are just going on filling a cup up with kibble and feeding it, that`s the impression I am getting, you are not weighing the food out , but imply filling 3 cups up a day and giving it to him, correct me if I am wrong on this.

You need to look at the weight chart for that particular food, it will give you a guide as to the amount you need to feed, do not go on his present weight but an ideal weight for the dog, granted he is a mix breed so its a bit tricky to know what his ideal weight is, so for now look at what a good weight should be for a Lab..... and feed accordingly. If you don`t have a weight cup for that brand of food, (some brands provide their own cup measure) then use a weigh scale. for instance,

Dog's weight in kg Amount in g/day
1 - 3 36 - 73
3 - 5 73 - 103
5 - 10 103 - 165
10 - 15 165 - 217
15 - 20 217 - 263
20 - 25 263 - 309
25 - 30 309 - 345
30 - 35 345 - 382
35 - 40 382 - 417
40 - 45 417 - 453
45 - 50 453 - 490

So lets say he should be around 30-35 kg, you would be feeding between 345-385 grams a day, spit into as many meals as you like, this is just a guide, but your own dog food will have a guide on the back...

Weigh the daily amount out on the scales them divide into your cup... and see how that measures up to what you are feeding now, just giving 3 full cups a day could be far to much food, when you put a dog on a weight plan you have to be accurate with the amount you feed.

BTW I am not telling you off at all, I am just responding to your appeal for help, from what you are posting I am picking up the mistakes you are making, its up to you as to whether you wish to listen to what I have to say, I am sure your intentions are in the right place, but what you are doing is not working.

Weight loss food is in my opinion a waste of money, its expensive and from my own personal experience it does not satisfy their hunger, but others will have their own opinion n this, it your choice , but to be honest, I think it really is as simple as you may be feeding to much and not enough exercise...

What ever you try and it starts to work, will be the right way for you to go.