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Fernsmum
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01-02-2010, 11:27 AM
Originally Posted by JoedeeUK View Post
Sorry I totally disagree, if Governments start to pay ransoms then more citizens of that country will be kidnapped. This really does happen, terrorists should not be capitulated to in any circumstances.

They knew the risks when they sailed into the area where Somali terrorists sieze ships let alone a yacht. Whilst people should be fee to travel where they like, this was a very foolish thing to choose to do. There is plenty of ocean to sail in.

Sad but true IMHO

I completely agree . In fact I can't even think of anything to add to this post .
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madmare
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01-02-2010, 11:39 AM
I agree sad as it is that the goverment should not pay any ransom. It will make these pirates and others think twice about kidnapping anymore British as they know they won't get a penny.
On the other side they could get angry and just kill any Britt they can get thier hands on as payback for the goverment not meeting thier demands.
The worst thing though is I bet if it was Tony Blair and his wife or the queen and her hubby they would have paid immeadietly, which would be wrong as at the end of the day we are all human beings with the same feelings of fear and emotion, so should be treated the same.
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Borderdawn
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01-02-2010, 11:56 AM
Originally Posted by JoedeeUK View Post
Sorry I totally disagree, if Governments start to pay ransoms then more citizens of that country will be kidnapped. This really does happen, terrorists should not be capitulated to in any circumstances.

They knew the risks when they sailed into the area where Somali terrorists sieze ships let alone a yacht. Whilst people should be fee to travel where they like, this was a very foolish thing to choose to do. There is plenty of ocean to sail in.

Sad but true IMHO
This says it all for me. They KNEW what they were doing and were warned NOT to sail there.
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Meg
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01-02-2010, 12:06 PM
Would I sail in/ allow someone to take me into waters in an area known to be frequented by pirates ..no

If I did and got picked up and held would I expect my government to pay my ransom..no .

I wouldn't go trekking in the mountains of Afghanistan either, it's called using a little common sense.
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JoedeeUK
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01-02-2010, 12:30 PM
Originally Posted by madmare View Post
The worst thing though is I bet if it was Tony Blair and his wife or the queen and her hubby they would have paid immeadietly, which would be wrong as at the end of the day we are all human beings with the same feelings of fear and emotion, so should be treated the same.

You are way off the mark there. All governments in this country have had a no ransom policy for many years, no matter who has been taken. Think of Terry Waite he was a profile hostage who wasn't ransomed.

High profile people like politicians, royals etc are very unlikely to go off sailing into "pirate"waters unprotected.
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Lucky Star
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01-02-2010, 01:01 PM
I'm terribly sorry for what has happened to these people but I don't agree that this country should pay ransom demands. If we did, it would be open season and we might as well cut the red tape (the kidnap process), give the pirates access to the Treasury and instruct them to take whatever they like, when they like.

Do the pirates really wish to hurt these people? I thought they have typically treated hostages well in the past, ensuring a good ransom. I do think that the original reasons we are told that drove fishermen to become pirates (illegal fishing, lost livelihoods, dumping of toxic waste plus civil war) have become hazy and these are now big organisations with lots of money and arms. It's been very lucrative.
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Lorna
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01-02-2010, 02:27 PM
Originally Posted by Lucky Star View Post

Do the pirates really wish to hurt these people? I thought they have typically treated hostages well in the past, ensuring a good ransom.
They've been kept apart from each other for 2 months, they're not being treated well at all she has a cracked tooth where she was hit over the head.

I am shocked that so many people feel this way, I really am! Don't really know how to even begin to reply, I found this out in Uni today, 50% agreed with me yet others don't....

I don't understand it at all - really don't. Its money at the end of the day, we have plenty as a country, save these two and put more provisions in place to ensure it doesn't happen again. I vaguely remember hearing that something went wrong and thats how the ended up in that area, don't quote me but I don't think it was done on purpose!

Even if it was, they deserve to be enjoying their lives together, not going through hell, yes it would cause problems, but I believe that allowing these two people to die would be a serious error in judgement!!!!

Imagine it was someone you loved out there I'd be livid that they weren't being paid to be set free! And as for if it was royalty yes, they'd have paid in a heartbeat and no the queen doesn't go anywhere like that, but her grandson does!
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Hali
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01-02-2010, 02:48 PM
Originally Posted by Lorna View Post
They've been kept apart from each other for 2 months, they're not being treated well at all she has a cracked tooth where she was hit over the head.

I am shocked that so many people feel this way, I really am! Don't really know how to even begin to reply, I found this out in Uni today, 50% agreed with me yet others don't....

I don't understand it at all - really don't. Its money at the end of the day, we have plenty as a country, save these two and put more provisions in place to ensure it doesn't happen again. I vaguely remember hearing that something went wrong and thats how the ended up in that area, don't quote me but I don't think it was done on purpose!

Even if it was, they deserve to be enjoying their lives together, not going through hell, yes it would cause problems, but I believe that allowing these two people to die would be a serious error in judgement!!!!

Imagine it was someone you loved out there I'd be livid that they weren't being paid to be set free! And as for if it was royalty yes, they'd have paid in a heartbeat and no the queen doesn't go anywhere like that, but her grandson does!
I think its the difference between an idealist and a realist.

Yes of course as individuals their lives are worth much more than the randsom being demanded. But as an idealist, that is as far as you can see. The realists know that you would be saving these two at the peril of many, many others.

You think that we have enough money to sort out the problem. Believe me we don't. Yes, the randsom for this couple is small fry for our government, but if we pay, it will quickly escalate. You are possibly thinking of just somali and that Brits could avoid the area, but there are 1,000s and 1,000s of Brits working in poorer countries who would all become targets if we are seen to give way to kidnappers.

And what happens to the millions and millions you would have us pay to these kidnappers. The majority of the pirates get a very small cut of randsoms, the majority going to mastermind criminals. These criminals will use this money to buy weapons and mercenaries and will try and gain more and more power, killing more and more innocent people as they do so.

I do understand your sentiment, but you are too niaive if you cannot understand ours.
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Lorna
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01-02-2010, 02:59 PM
Originally Posted by Hali View Post
I think its the difference between an idealist and a realist.

Yes of course as individuals their lives are worth much more than the randsom being demanded. But as an idealist, that is as far as you can see. The realists know that you would be saving these two at the peril of many, many others.

You think that we have enough money to sort out the problem. Believe me we don't. Yes, the randsom for this couple is small fry for our government, but if we pay, it will quickly escalate. You are possibly thinking of just somali and that Brits could avoid the area, but there are 1,000s and 1,000s of Brits working in poorer countries who would all become targets if we are seen to give way to kidnappers.

And what happens to the millions and millions you would have us pay to these kidnappers. The majority of the pirates get a very small cut of randsoms, the majority going to mastermind criminals. These criminals will use this money to buy weapons and mercenaries and will try and gain more and more power, killing more and more innocent people as they do so.

I do understand your sentiment, but you are too niaive if you cannot understand ours.
I understand them, I just don't agree with them.

Kidnappings will always happen, always, even if we don't pay!

If I was kidnapped I would expect my government to do everything to free me. End of. Thats not being an idealist, its being a realist, I expect to be protected.
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Fernsmum
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01-02-2010, 03:12 PM
If I was stupid enough to go sailing where I was warned not to go I would not be expecting anyone to pay a ransom to get me out . The same applies if it was any of my family .
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