It's unfortunate that, thanks to puppy farming and the internet, it's not only possible for morons to buy "choke" collars, it's also possible for them to buy the dogs to "choke" them with.

As previously stated, if used correctly they are fine.

Unfortunately, there will always be irresponsible people on this planet. I can't help that.

BTW, I prefer the term "check" collar, as I prefer to "check" my dog, not "choke" him.

Fully agree with above. Missy pulls so hard in a flat collar that she wheezes and gags . I tried a check chain and when she tried to pull, she almost strangled herself so I never used it again. On that occassion, I even unclipped her leather lead and used that round her neck instead just to get her home. Tried various harnesses, the kind that claim to stop pulling, but she still pulled ! Got a broad nylon half check which she walked fairly well in but needed to be checked quite a lot as she still tried to pull . I bought a fine leather half check and now I hardly know she's there . All of this was in conjunction with weekly training classes. I think it is a case of trial and error, and finding what works best for each dog as an individual.

So what is involved in check/choke training, is it just a case if yanking on the dogs collar, If so, I assumed most of you were against this?

Good grief! There's certainly no "yanking" involved.

When I went to training schools with my previous dogs, 2 rough collies and a GSD, I was obliged to use choke chains. None of the dogs suffered through their use. I used choke chains all their lives, even after they learned to walk properly, for the simple reason that they are a lot easier to put on and off a long haired dog than a buckle type collar. With my present dog, a BSD, I use a half check, because of its ease of use. I cannot see that a half check is any worse than a buckle collar, because they cannot fully tighten onto the dogs neck, therefor there is no risk of strangulation.

Missy was 18 months old and not trained when I rehomed her in January. I immediately enrolled her in a basic obedience class. First night, I was hauled round the hall for most of the hour, and had blisters on my hands ! She came into season and missed the next 3 classes, but I did lots of training at home. Begining with working in the house, it was mostly lots of walk, stop and sit, repeated over the session. Also turns and change of direction, which kept her interest and didn't give her the chance to pull. Yes, at the beginning, lots of gentle tugs were required to encourage her to follow. But more effective, was praise and reward when she did well. This training was also done when out for a walk. Although Missy cuoldn't go to the classes, I was able to go and borrowed one of the trainer's dogs. This way, I was still learning and could train my own dog at home. When she was able to go back to the class, despite missing 3 classes, she was then ahead of every other dog on this 8 week course. It was her first time back that my trainer suggested a half check collar. She was so excited about meeting the other dogs that she reverted back to pulling. Rather than have her pull on a flat collar for an hour, it was kinder to use the half check. The actual training is no different.

When good old Barbara Woodhouse showed us all how to use check chains, it was very much about giving a very strong jerk and selecting the correct type of check chain.

Historically as far as I'm aware, the correct use has been to jerk (I may be wrong so if anyone knows different, do say). A jerk can be a quick flick or else a real yank. Once the dog has learnt the check chain is something to avoid, (and this will only happen if the owner's timing is consistent and excellent) the chain is usually used less harshly and may only be flicked.

I'd be interested to hear what is considered correct use - I used them back in the 1980s and did use them a la Barbara Woodhouse (ie jerking them, sadly I was also a jerk, on the other end of the lead, I knew no better and I jerked far too hard ).

In the 80's in was generally accepted that it was correct to train with choke chains. When training my GSD, I went to a BGSD training school class and all the dogs were GSD's. Some of them were massive, and the owners would jerk them with all their strength, using choke chains, with the encouragemnet of the trainers.

I wernt for two years, and to my knowledge, no dogs were ever hurt or injured. Obviously, this sort of force would not have been used on a small dog, like a KC spaniel or poodle.

I do not condone the use of choke chains today, but think that they may have their place with some breeds and dogs.

From what I've heard i understand that check or choke chains should be used to produce a sound that indicates pulling is a no no? But how that's achieved I've no idea.

I've bought Isla a choke chain for when she's fully grown, but it's for decoration only as I've no idea how to use one propery!

It HAS to be used properly, Rips, or it won't release. Put it on your wrist and pull it tight - if it relaxes when you stop pulling it, then that's the way your dog should wear it.