We almost always have a dozen or more male, entire border collies here on the farm. At the moment, we have one bitch (also entire).

There are occasionally spats between the boys, but nothing serious. Fights are usually caused by one dog finding a dead rabbit and someone else trying to steal it

My entire male border collie, who is now around 10 years old, is exceptionally well behaved and has never initiated fights or tried to retaliate. He is friendly to males and females, does not mark in the house, try and hump other dogs etc.

I think you need to source your pup carefully, and ensure he comes from a line of sociable, good natured collies. Then plan your training and socialisation regime carefully.

I would only neuter a male now if there were health problems associated with being entire.

Have you started the search for your pup yet? When you say pedigree border collie, are you looking for a pup from KC registered stock?

The implant is not to be used on pre pubescent dogs as it stops the production of testosterone which is needed to close the growth plates in the long bones of the legs. Early castration results in the dog not maturing properly, growing taller than normal & also retaining immature behaviours as well as a heightened risk of prostate cancer than in entire dogs. All mammals produce both testosterone & oestrogen & to remove the main source of testosterone can also result in the dog being attractive to other males due to the oestrogen being produced.

I have trained my entire(now 7 year old)BC to fetch my walking stick, the phone & also helping me get up if I fall as I cannot get up unaided. It didn't take much training & I cannot see that neutering him would have improved his speed of learning. My other dogs have picked up on these things & I often have two or more of them helping me.

The way to stop any behaviour you do not want is to ensure that the behaviour is never rewarding & make desired behaviour is very rewarding

lol@anniebee.. the randy old goat!!

As I said before I think, our two male dogs growing up were left entire and lived long healthy lives eventually passing away at 17 (for both of them - corgi cross and lab/collie cross) , though we didn't have them at the same time. Neither of them got on well with other dogs with the exception of Sam (the collie cross) been ok with the neighbours elderly male collie, but he'd grown up living next door to him and my mum used to have him while they were at work.

Sam was difficult to handle at first been so big but I was a a teen and I'm only 5ft 3 at my adult height.. lol! My brother also got bit trying to seperate him fighting with another dog and had to go to hospital for a rather painful injection in his bum, needless to say he refused to walk him after that and I was a nervous wreck! funny how we remember these things over 20yr on!!

I guess I'm scared of a repeat with not been as mobile. You tend to imagine the worst!

I'm glad to hear there are so many well behaved entire males out there!

I think we didn't know anything near the amount we know now about dog training. Even when I first got Inca (2001) I didn't have internet then just literally picked her up from a woman who rescued unwanted pets with no knowledge of collies (except Sam but he was more yellow lab to be honest). It's easy to know with hindsight!

He doesn't have to be KC registered as I won't be 'showing' him, but I mean proper Border collie as opposed to collie crossbreed. .. preferably the traditional black & white medium/long coated BC.

I've contacted one breeder so far still waiting for a reply the mother of the pup is an obedience champion and obedience is kind of important to train a dog to level of an assistance dog. If I've had no reply by end of week I'll try someone else. I'd hope to have one by Jan/feb at latest. I was hoping Inca could retire before she reached 13. (March 2014)

I have four border collies, three boys and a girl. Apart from the latest boy who is still entire, they were all neutered at around 6/7 months, as were my previous male and female collies. None of them has grown particularly tall or had issues with being neutered young. They are all okay with other dogs. My youngest is a year old and I haven't had him castrated yet because he had surgery on a knee at four months following an accident so I felt he had had enough to cope with. As it is, I feel no need to have him done so far as he doesn't even cock his leg, although he will try and hump my bitch (and she stands and lets him!) even though she is spayed. Having said all that, I do have to watch him with other dogs as he does occasionally jump on a more submissive one although this may just be his hormones and I will have him castrated if it becomes an issue. Sooo, it's difficult to generalise and I think you have to do a lot more research before making up your mind! Good luck.

Thanks. I think I might go with 'wait and see' approach and see what he was actually like once reaching that age rather than neutering him before he actually got chance to reach that stage.

What made you have the other boys done at 6/7 months? was that cos of behavioural issues emerging?

Are they generally (as a breed) not aggressive towards other dogs even in their 'teens' before reaching maturity?

Not at all. It was generally advised by my vets and, not really knowing much about it, I bowed to their superior knowledge!

Not generally aggressive, no, but I have know some unpleasant characters! I meet them mostly in the agility world so they can be even more hyped up than usual but, on the whole, they are a pretty sociable breed.

ok thanks

We won't be going into anything that competitive, though Inca does already have an agility course for the garden and I've just got her the GoDogGo ball launcher to encourage her to play and exercise when we usually get snowed in just after xmas! They will share stuff like this that would be too expensive to buy them one each!

Hoping to get him interested in chew toys too to keep him out of mischief! The new one by Stagbar looks good with stagbar with rope threaded through each end and a solid chewy ring that's moved along.

Plus he'll be busy learning more important stuff! I figure half of behavioural issues are boredom or lack of mental stimulation.. so full time 'puppy school' for first 2 yrs.. lol!

I'm currently considering getting a male Border Collie myself so it's interesting to see this post.

If I do get a male then I will have him done, firstly because my Westie bitch has not been done and secondly I just think neutered males tend to be less aggressive or dominant but I'm only going off my own limited experience and previously I've always had females.

There is no guarantee that a dog that has had the snip will not try to mount a bitch, my friends bitch was mated by a castrated dog (he had been castrated for a couple of years).

Vets seem overly keen on neutering anything that moves, I certainly wouldn't even consider it until he is fully mature.

what age would that be?

Also for purpose of the more physical tasks I need him to learn requiring him to stand on back legs (like put letter in postbox) or pull my chair/rollator back to me (manual) to transfer from sofa/scooter etc. I'd leave those until last..would after 12 months be ok or would he still be growing until 2yrs old? (Inca was 4yrs by time I needed her to do those kinds of jobs anyway)

I think I read somewhere an age recommendation for them starting high intensity sports and not before their bones etc were fully developed by, but can't remember the age it recommended?

Would neuturing him early affect his bone strength for doing jobs like that? ..or maybe they'd get weaker earlier so shortening his 'working life'?