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labradork
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27-05-2010, 02:20 PM
Absolutely nothing, just as there is nothing wrong with breeding German Shepherds, except they are prone to highly abnormal hip joints, the implication of which is you need to be very, VERY careful when breeding them to avoid uncontrollable and irreversible pain from birth.
LOL; with the greatest of respects, did you read the BVA mean hip scores? because if you did, you would know that Border Collie scored 13, Springer Spaniels scored 12 and Labrador Retrievers scored 15. That is a 1-2 point difference in scores. So, given that statistically there is pretty much nothing in the average difference between these three breeds scores, does that mean you would consider Collies and Springers to being prone to 'highly abnormal hip joints'?

I think you need to get your facts straight before you post, because you are not justifying your reasons for breeding very well.
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labradork
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27-05-2010, 02:20 PM
Sorry, Springers scored 14, not 12.
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SBL
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27-05-2010, 02:21 PM
Golden Retriever scored 18, sorry for the confusion
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Tassle
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27-05-2010, 02:26 PM
Again, as I've said before, comments like this do no justice, you need to explain.
I assumed you would have realsied - as I'm sure most people did - I was referring to the fact you bred without the intention of keeping a pup - thats what I found sad.

However - I am now assuming you joined the forum and added the pictures in the hope of selling these two that you have left then.
My assumption was that you were keeping these pups that you are so proudly displaying. Silly me.
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labradork
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27-05-2010, 02:26 PM
well, I'm pretty sure most people on here where arguing that HD was purely genetic (check the thread), it seems my research was supriour those peoples at least.
Again, you need to get your facts straight. HD IS purely genetic, but it is a polygenic condition. Polygenic means the severity of the condition can be influenced by environmental issues such as poor nutrition, over exercise, etc. You cannot CAUSE a condition such as HD by over exercising or feeding a poor diet if the dog is not genetically pre-disposed to it. This factors can only influence the severity of the disease if the dog already HAS the disease. And of course, HD doesn't normally rear its head until the dog is 6 months and above in age.
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SBL
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27-05-2010, 02:28 PM
@Tassle Not at all. My intention was not to sell them on here (I could have lied about HIP tests etc )

I would love to keep one, and have had to tear myself away from doing so, but I have two dogs and that is enough. One has gone to a couple from wales who are into fell walking, one has gone to a gentleman from Glasgow who already has a Sprollie and wanted a companion for it. My ex/gf is meant to be having one, and the other is probably going to a home in Manchester, but yes, I would love to keep one
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labradork
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27-05-2010, 02:29 PM
Golden Retriever scored 18, sorry for the confusion
So you think that statistically, a score of 14 is signifcantly more than a score of 18? because I can assure you, it is not. If you were comparing the score of a very low scoring breed (some breeds have scores of 6, 7, etc.) to the score of 18, that would be statistically significant. BC and Springer compared a GR score is not sigificant. So by your own admission, the two breeds you crossed have 'highly abnormal hips'.
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SBL
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27-05-2010, 02:30 PM
Again, you need to get your facts straight. HD IS purely genetic, but it is a polygenic condition. Polygenic means the severity of the condition can be influenced by environmental issues such as poor nutrition, over exercise, etc. You cannot CAUSE a condition such as HD by over exercising or feeding a poor diet if the dog is not genetically pre-disposed to it. This factors can only influence the severity of the disease if the dog already HAS the disease. And of course, HD doesn't normally rear its head until the dog is 6 months and above in age.
You should re-read the research

So you think that statistically, a score of 14 is signifcantly more than a score of 18? because I can assure you, it is not. If you were comparing the score of a very low scoring breed (some breeds have scores of 6, 7, etc.) to the score of 18, that would be statistically significant. BC and Springer compared a GR score is not sigificant. So by your own admission, the two breeds you crossed have 'highly abnormal hips'.
Yes, in the range of those results, I would say that well outside the norm
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labradork
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27-05-2010, 02:35 PM
You should re-read the research
I have thank you - extensively.

I'm not sure what you are trying to dispute. You are again making excuses for the fact you couldn't be bothered to hip score your dogs before bringing more crossbreed puppies into the world.
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Borderdawn
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27-05-2010, 02:38 PM
More crossbreeds purposely bred for money......sad!
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