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Jirmette
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22-08-2011, 01:57 PM

Help with aggressive episode in puppy please?

Cooper's a 16 weeks old St Bernard, he's no bother at all, a real pleasure to have around. Every evening he has around a 30 window where for no apparent reason he gets all excited and is very nippy / challenging - which we've just put down to being normal puppy behaviour, but as far as work/challenges go, that's pretty much been it! We put him back behind his stair gate in the dining room (remove him from us) and he'll instantly calm.

Last night though he literally went bananas and I can't think of a single reason for it.

We been on our usual evening stroll - most evenings when the sun has gone in we wander up to the local play park - a 7/8 minute walk, sit there for around an hour while Cooper sleeps under the bench / meets other dogs & children, and my son plays on the play equipment

As we left to walk back, it was obvious he wasn't too happy about leaving (?tired) which again isn't that unusual as he loves all the attention he gets there, but after walking for a minute or so, he kept going for me, there was no snarling or teeth on display, but he meant it (whereas usually it's just puppy nippiness/excitement, this felt different) and has put several holes in my clothes (and skin). I held his collar and managed to calm him down by stroking him and eventually sat on the ground and cuddled/soothed him until he calmed down.

Once we started walking, he did the same thing again, DS left us and went to play, bumped his head and came over crying so Cooper gave him a bite on the tummy, at that point I smacked him on his nose and shouted "No" loudly to him, eventually he calmed back down, and after that he walked back home absolutely fine, went to his bed, and looked really sad.

I feel awful about the whole situation, that it happened, that I may have caused it, that I didn't handle it correctly etc. When it first happened, it scared me which I'm sure he would have picked up on and exascerbated the situation, hence why I got down and cuddled him to calm him (and regain my confidence), so I don't know if this was purely an excited/angry puppy who found a way to control me or if there was something very wrong.

Any advice very much appreciated.

Thank you
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Tupacs2legs
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22-08-2011, 02:10 PM
.....squealy crying child and over stimulated puppy not a good mix ...still does not warrant a slap on the nose

i would say do more training and fun games with him other than sitting and watching the world go by...

also..what food/treats are u feeding? is their any relation to feeding time when these 'episodes' happen of an eve?

my csv used to have a crazy half hour when he was a pup after eating his dinner,he grew out of it...mind u my ex used to too...he didnt grow out of it tho
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Jirmette
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22-08-2011, 02:24 PM
Thank you for your reply, just to clarify though...

My son wasn't squealy! He bumped his head and was crying, not screaming, squealing or being loud, he was hurt, upset & tearful.

Cooper was uncontrollable, I've never smacked him on his nose and it was a last resort, if I let go of his collar, I got a nasty bite - I'm covered in bite marks and scratch marks today and my clothes I was wearing are ruined. Not knowing at all how to regain control of the situation (having done so once and seeing the same occur) I used it as a last resort.

I feel bad enough about it as it is, I posted here to ask for advice, not to be told off.

He is fed 4 times a day with Iams giant puppy food, as he has been since we got him, no change last night and no, the usual excited incidents don't appear to be tied in with food time. He doesn't have treats, we use his own dried food to reward when training.

With regard to diet and exercise, I've taken advice from several breeders.

Everything extrinsic last night was the same as every other night, apart from his outburst, no change in food, no change in routine, no new dogs around, the park was relatively quiet by the time we left, the only thing that differed was this out of character behaviour.
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Ben Mcfuzzylugs
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22-08-2011, 02:24 PM
agree with above
I really like where you said you let him calm down stroking him
but a smack on the nose isnt a good thing imo

Most puppies have a mad 1/2 hour where they just have too much energy and cant think properly
teaching him that nice things happen to him when he is calm, doing things that make him think before his mad time is due and giving him something nice to gnaw/lick at - like a frozen stufffed kong (all before he starts the mad time) can all help your sanity
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Tupacs2legs
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22-08-2011, 02:40 PM
Originally Posted by Jirmette View Post
Thank you for your reply, just to clarify though...

My son wasn't squealy! He bumped his head and was crying, not screaming, squealing or being loud, he was hurt, upset & tearful.
which can be very appealing to a dog/puppy
Cooper was uncontrollable, I've never smacked him on his nose and it was a last resort, if I let go of his collar, I got a nasty bite - I'm covered in bite marks and scratch marks today and my clothes I was wearing are ruined. Not knowing at all how to regain control of the situation (having done so once and seeing the same occur) I used it as a last resort.

I feel bad enough about it as it is, I posted here to ask for advice, not to be told off.

im not telling u off but its likely to make hands even more tempting to bite in the future!

He is fed 4 times a day with Iams giant puppy food, as he has been since we got him, no change last night and no, the usual excited incidents don't appear to be tied in with food time. He doesn't have treats, we use his own dried food to reward when training.

With regard to diet and exercise, I've taken advice from several breeders.

Everything extrinsic last night was the same as every other night, apart from his outburst, no change in food, no change in routine, no new dogs around, the park was relatively quiet by the time we left, the only thing that differed was this out of character behaviour.
im likely to say he is understimulated and is winding himself up... like i said in my original post,games /training to use his brains,tire him out more satisfactualy(to him) and to increase your bond and get to know each other more,he is a baby with a brain that needs directing...much like ur own 'baby'

also as ben mcfuz says...he needs to learn to 'wind down' too...so kongs,calm grooming etc
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Loki's mum
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22-08-2011, 02:46 PM
Lots of pups have a silly hour, often in the evening. Our Mal used to do zoomies round the lounge, though she has stopped now (she's six months). I would give him a time out in a crate, maybe with a filled kong or bone as a distraction. Make it clear to him that this silliness is not acceptable but there are other outlets for his energy. If he does it the same time every evening, you could try doing some clicker work with him before the witching hour to help wear out his brain.
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smokeybear
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22-08-2011, 02:47 PM
Originally Posted by Jirmette View Post
Cooper's a 16 weeks old St Bernard, he's no bother at all, a real pleasure to have around. Every evening he has around a 30 window where for no apparent reason he gets all excited and is very nippy / challenging - which we've just put down to being normal puppy behaviour, but as far as work/challenges go, that's pretty much been it! We put him back behind his stair gate in the dining room (remove him from us) and he'll instantly calm.

Last night though he literally went bananas and I can't think of a single reason for it.

We been on our usual evening stroll - most evenings when the sun has gone in we wander up to the local play park - a 7/8 minute walk, sit there for around an hour while Cooper sleeps under the bench / meets other dogs & children, and my son plays on the play equipment

As we left to walk back, it was obvious he wasn't too happy about leaving (?tired) which again isn't that unusual as he loves all the attention he gets there, but after walking for a minute or so, he kept going for me, there was no snarling or teeth on display, but he meant it (whereas usually it's just puppy nippiness/excitement, this felt different) and has put several holes in my clothes (and skin). I held his collar and managed to calm him down by stroking him and eventually sat on the ground and cuddled/soothed him until he calmed down.

Once we started walking, he did the same thing again, DS left us and went to play, bumped his head and came over crying so Cooper gave him a bite on the tummy, at that point I smacked him on his nose and shouted "No" loudly to him, eventually he calmed back down, and after that he walked back home absolutely fine, went to his bed, and looked really sad.

I feel awful about the whole situation, that it happened, that I may have caused it, that I didn't handle it correctly etc. When it first happened, it scared me which I'm sure he would have picked up on and exascerbated the situation, hence why I got down and cuddled him to calm him (and regain my confidence), so I don't know if this was purely an excited/angry puppy who found a way to control me or if there was something very wrong.

Any advice very much appreciated.

Thank you
Have you spoken to the breeder?

Have you spoken to the vet?
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Krusewalker
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22-08-2011, 03:07 PM
Hello Jirmette

Are you a mumsnetter?
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Jirmette
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22-08-2011, 03:15 PM
Originally Posted by Krusewalker View Post
Hello Jirmette

Are you a mumsnetter?
I've heard of it, but no, never used it.
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Krusewalker
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22-08-2011, 03:20 PM
Originally Posted by Jirmette View Post
I've heard of it, but no, never used it.
it was the DS phrase that pinged my radar.

i went on their once, all this DS and DD so on, drove me mad.

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