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Location: Nottingham, UK
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 9,540
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12-08-2011, 08:08 AM
TBH - my dad's been saying it for years - what public services' like schools and the police need is more discipline. Police should be allowed to use force when they see forces is needed and schools IMO need more discipline. And parents* - jeez if I was brought up in this day and age - I'd get away with murder. (*some) I don't mean full blown canes and smacking - but more than words, there needs to be something - kids don't listen to "don't do that - consequences" anymore, maybe being shown the consequences of their actions...
Originally Posted by Hevvur 
Blow up the world, will probsbly cost a lot, but it won't matter cos we'll all be dead
Originally Posted by Jackbox
And I think you will find the majority of the country is appalled at the way this country has gone, due to the its not their fault and PC brigade attitude that is displayed by some,
Bigotry and ignorance........I dont think so.... disbelief, anger, frustration despair, are more of a description of what this country is feeling at the moment.
Originally Posted by rich c
On the subject of National Service, I raised this with an ex-serviceman today and his opinion was much the same as mine. The armed forces, who we all hold in great esteem, do not have the facilities/manpower to act as nursemaids. Nor should they be asked to. Our armed forces are supposed to be highly skilled professionals, not a rag-tag bunch of unwilling conscripts!
Originally Posted by Helena54
and a very highly respected bunch too by the majority of us, putting their own lives at risk for the benefit of this country and its people, and by chucking these scum into it wouldn't do the esteem we hold for them much good.
National Service could be a totally different department to the army recruitment programme though. It works in lots of countries, whereby ALL young men HAVE to do a certain amount of time in national service, it teaches them lots of things as well as how to behave in society, which is severely lacking in these hooligans. We need the real hardcore sergeant majors in charge of them too
, somebody who's really going to sort them out! They won't need benefits either, coz they'll be getting free board and lodgings, so a bit of pocket money will suffice! Their benefit money can pay for it all too! I'm with you Jackie!
My OH doesn't get free board, food or anything - he has to pay for everything out of his wages.. or are you thinking up an idea - I don't really understand your post..
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Location: A Scot in Thailand
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 474
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12-08-2011, 08:16 AM
Originally Posted by smokeybear
And you patently know very little about the Halliburton corporation, one I am extremely familiar with.
Your post is but one example of the ignorance of which I spoke on my previous post.
Perhaps you could give me a breakdown of how much money the government has and its sources?
Because I fail to understand how the government gets the majority of its finance from corporations.
I do not know where you get this misinformation but you obvioously do not WORK for a corporation.
No corporation or ANY employer can employ anyone for less than the minimum wage. This is a fact.
And as for your statement of why African countries are so poor it is so inane I can hardly bring myself to believe that anyone would write such drivel.
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Location: March, Cambridgeshire.
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 35,628
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12-08-2011, 08:21 AM
Originally Posted by smokeybear
Apparently there was a poster in Poland
Did you SEE this poster? were you IN Poland? did you understand what it ACTUALLY said?
Another incendiary comment guaranteed to stir people up.
How people CHOOSE to live is surely ENTIRELY up to them?
So WHAT if people wish to live in communities (of course British expats never do any such thing), that is their CHOICE, most people like to live around people with similar outlooks, interests, etc that applies to ALL nationalities and cultures.
And if they send their money home, so WHAT, that is THEIR business, nobody else’s
The statement that companies prefer to employ Europeans over Brits as they are easier to get rid of is total codswallop, you cannot, they are entitled to the same rights as we are; another incendiary false rumour.
Only pay out for one child (young mothers)
Ah so you if you are an older mother you can have more children? Hmm that sounds just, fair and logical.
The above are examples of bigoted and ignorant comments over and above those identified in direct response to BKs post.
There was nothing bigoted about my remark it is fact. I have no issues with any member of another nationality working here if they are legal to do so. I was merely pointing out that when some people say our own people won't work for the lower wages this in some cases is the reason why. My eldest son being one of them.
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Location: South East UK
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 27,437
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12-08-2011, 08:26 AM
Originally Posted by SLB
My OH doesn't get free board, food or anything - he has to pay for everything out of his wages.. or are you thinking up an idea - I don't really understand your post..
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Location: UK
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,122
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12-08-2011, 08:26 AM
Originally Posted by smokeybear
Apparently there was a poster in Poland
Did you SEE this poster? were you IN Poland? did you understand what it ACTUALLY said?
Another incendiary comment guaranteed to stir people up.
How people CHOOSE to live is surely ENTIRELY up to them?
So WHAT if people wish to live in communities (of course British expats never do any such thing), that is their CHOICE, most people like to live around people with similar outlooks, interests, etc that applies to ALL nationalities and cultures.
And if they send their money home, so WHAT, that is THEIR business, nobody else’s
The statement that companies prefer to employ Europeans over Brits as they are easier to get rid of is total codswallop, you cannot, they are entitled to the same rights as we are; another incendiary false rumour.
i think your problem may be , as happens with many a bureaucrat, is you live in a world of rules and regulations, and cant see the woods for the trees,..
Everyone has rights, everyone has to be paid minimum wage, employers have to do this that and the other... well in real life people do get exploited on a daily basis, and yes SOME might get caught and fined, but many dont.
Its an individual's right to do what they like with the money they earn, of course it is.... unless you are getting paid in cash, and sending most of that cash home.
There's something wrong with a system that encourages immigrants here to work, but allows them to be paid in cash, and put none of it back into our economy.... its a one sided deal, they come take all the emenaties... AND PUT NOTHING BACK.
Get in the real world and take a look through the trees.
Only pay out for one child (young mothers)
Ah so you if you are an older mother you can have more children? Hmm that sounds just, fair and logical.
The above are examples of bigoted and ignorant comments over and above those identified in direct response to BKs post.
You still have not given your views on how to mend this country, all you can do is accuse others of bigotry and ignorance!
And as you have included my statement in your attack, I assume you disagree with the statistics of this culture of young girls getting pregnant at 15/16 and seeing it as a way of life, another baby a bigger house more money.
I wonder why we have the dubious label of having the highest rate of "young mums" in Europe.
America did it, the cut the birth rate of young single mothers down dramatically, so it could work here to.
I know, I know, you are going to throw the bigot at me again
not to worry, but maybe you aught to take your head out of all your legalisation it seems to be buried in and do as the rest of us, take a look around at how it really is.P.S......going to put my tin hat on and duck for cover!!!
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Location: Nottingham, UK
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 9,540
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12-08-2011, 08:56 AM
Originally Posted by Helena54
Your O/H is in the actual ARMY, whereas I'm referring to the new bootcamp/national service idea we've dreamed up for the hooligans, and bearing in mind MOST of them will be receiving handouts, they would all stop, to pay for their board and lodgings (in an ideal world of course!).
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Location: Wiltshire UK
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,404
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12-08-2011, 08:56 AM
Originally Posted by BangKaew
Every time you have been critical you have taken something out of context to which I have completely destroyed your argument.
Really I do not see any destruction at all.
There is no need to get personal but if that is how you want to debate, then I say to you that you probably work for Haliburton which means you are a merchant of death. Probably why you are so angry the whole time!
Again another ignorant remark(s).
First of all I do not work for Halliburton. Fact.
I am not a merchant of death. Fact.
I am not angry the whole time. Fact.
The Government by and large gets their money from taxation, corporate and personal. The Tories have always been sympathetic to corporations but Labour traditionally were not. But under new labour Gordon Brown fell in love with the City - majority of which is corporations and is a quarter of the UK's GDP, and a deal was done that he would not regulate and the government would have the hefty tax receipts in return. That policy came home to roost in '08 when the lack of regulation saw the banks implode, exactly like most gamblers do. Forgetting about corporation tax from the likes of BP, the Arms industry, the Pharmaceutical industry etc, the majority of high income tax payers work for corporations.
I see you have avoided my original question as you cannot in actual fact give me a breakdown of where the money comes from.
Or, if you could, it would be patently obvious the majority of money that the government obtains is not from corporations, that information is freely available on may websites. Yes they get tax from both corporations and personal but there are far bigger accruals from other levies.
No thankfully I do not. I am not talking about below the minimum wage. I am talking about getting a skilled imigrant who will do a role for less than someone from the UK. I am not saying that is necessarily wrong, I am saying that business prefers that to training someone locally. The local population do not benefit so again, government policy benefits business instead of the people.
I do not know where you get the FACTS that skilled immigrants fulfil a role for less than someone from the UK; that is not legal.
Of course there are ILLEGAL employers just as there are ILLEGAL employees!
FACTQuite often there are not the skills available locally or nationally so there is no choice BUT to employ those from abroad. FACT.
How do you think say a mining company gets the contract in a country with a dictator in charge? They make a deal where the dictator and fellow elite will do very well and the company will get the resource for very cheap. The people see none of the money. Let's not forget that the UK & US at one point were allies with Polpot, Bin Laden, Saddam and Gadaffi.
What has that got to do with the price of fish?
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Location: Wiltshire UK
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,404
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12-08-2011, 09:04 AM
Originally Posted by Jackbox
In your opinion I might add.
You still have not given your views on how to mend this country, all you can do is accuse others of bigotry and ignorance!
I never said I had a solution, I am not that arrogant or stupid to believe that I have all or indeed any of the answers, I commented on the ignorance and bigotry included in some of the threads.
I am entitled to do that as that is my opinion.
And as you have included my statement in your attack, I assume you disagree with the statistics of this culture of young girls getting pregnant at 15/16 and seeing it as a way of life, another baby a bigger house more money.
You can assume all your like, that is your prerogative. My comment was specific and did not encompass YOUR agenda.
I wonder why we have the dubious label of having the highest rate of "young mums" in Europe.
America did it, the cut the birth rate of young single mothers down dramatically, so it could work here to.
I know, I know, you are going to throw the bigot at me again
not to worry, but maybe you aught to take your head out of all your legalisation it seems to be buried in and do as the rest of us, take a look around at how it really is.I am not buried in legislation at all I live in the REAL world, that is how I KNOW the facts.
Of COURSE there are poor employers, illegal workers etc, just as there are good and poor parents, children, dog owners etc.
But the FACTS are the rules are the same for everyone.
And as for getting paid in cash, ANYONE is allowed to be paid in cash, whether you are an immigrant or not.
P.S......going to put my tin hat on and duck for cover!!!
As for putting nothing back, hmmm, do they not have to pay the same bills as the rest of us what EXACTLY do they NOT pay for or put back into the local economy?
Do they not have to eat, pay for fuel, utilities, clothes etc etc?????????????????
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Location: Wiltshire UK
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 14,404
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12-08-2011, 09:06 AM
Originally Posted by scorpio
Really?, even if you don't live there full time?
Can't see them enforcing it though and thankfully I am too old now.......
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