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Location: UK
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,723
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Originally Posted by
BangKaew
Here is the clip;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh9YOyM2TAk
It is the Malamut that I mentioned before. First of all this is more wolf than dog who would attack other dogs and whose owners could not control (could you? ) . This dog did not have any respect for anyone and certainly did not obey commands. Cesar's way, which is not the only way but is one way, is to do what a dog pack leader would do; dominate so the other dog obeys through fear. That may sound awful but
that is how a dog pack leader controls the pack and why Cesar uses that method.
Secondly. Cesar only strings him up when the Malamut is about to go for the other dog, Cesar corrects it, and goes to bite Cesar. Two points here. Dominating the dog. Cesar corrected the dog and the dog said 'you do not tell me what to do, you do not dominate me, I dominate you'. By stringing up as you say, Cesar was showing the dog that he was in control. Second point is that if Cesar did not pull the dogs front feet off the ground, the dog would be able to bite him so it was merely stopping a bite.
We have had indepth dthreads on this in the past if you search
But to address your points there
CM does not string the dog up when he goes for the other dog, the dog is not reacting so CM kicks the dog in the belly and as the dog turns towards him he strings him up - AT THIS POINT the dog starts fighting
and we are shown earlier in the episode that the 'lead' CM is using is actually a noose made from the dogs lead passed tru the handle
So the dog is stressed, he is with a strange person and around a dog he has history with
He is offered no guidance but kicked in the guts and then strangled - wouldnt you fight in that situation?
Plenty trainers rehabilitate dogs as bad or worse than the ones shown here, my dog was worse than shadow - albeit smaller - and I never had to wrestle to stop her biting me
GOOD trainers dont get into a situation where they will get bitten
Originally Posted by
BangKaew
I think you are looking at this the wrong way. I watched that clip and ok it might be unprofessional of Cesar to have laughed but I do not think it is that big a deal. He is after all going to rehabilitate the dog.
The only way to correct inappropriate behaviour is to correct them in the act. How can you tell a dog that attacking another dog or person is not acceptable, if you do not correct them at the moment it occurs? Cesar had to provoke an attack in order to correct it. That is using techniques dogs use.
Our second dog likes to chase chickens which is very dangerous in Thailand as the Thais would try to kill him if he killed a chicken. However one time he went for some but the local dogs caught him by the back legs and then went in front and forced him away. If he had gone on again he would have been bitten and that is more effective than if we tried to stop him. Cesar would do what a dog would.
No its not the only way - its just the only way that CM knows, there are better ways - especially with agression
The dog is not making a choice to be 'bad' it shows a very disturbed mind for a dog to be trying to fight and the mind has to be fixed - CM's method does not address the reason for the problem or make the dog like being in the presences of the other dogs more all he does is makes the dog more scared of CM than anything else so he suprreses all his natural warning and behaviours - if you look at the bodylaungage of shadow later when he is muzzled and pinned to the floor as other dogs are paraded past him he is in NO way happy with the other dogs there - everyone who ever handles him in the future will have to keep on putting the fear of g0d into that poor dog - because if at any times his fear of the other dog becomes greater than his fear of the handler his attack is going to be swift, silent and very sevear
Originally Posted by
BangKaew
I do find it amusing when people, like Ian Dunbar, talk about fighting Cesar! Humans have the ability to rationalize, dogs do not. I can not say to my dog - look, if you chase chickens you might get a machete in the back, or - if you drink that stagnant water you might get sick. But the language that dogs speak among each other is all energy and that is what Cesar replicates. Sometimes that includes physically touching the dogs, as they would.
I do not think it is rational to want to kick a human but if a dog bites it is not ok to finger jab them.
What energy is this? how is it measured?
Humans do not speak dog anyway - and dogs do not speak human - we have to teach them
It is natural for the dog to want to drink the stinky water
it is OUR job as humans to teach them to leave something when we ask them
we can do that with kindness understanding that they are only doing something natural and have no idea we dont want them to
or we can do it with punishments
each work in their own ways - but punishing when they have no understanding of what we want just isnt fair imo