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Ripsnorterthe2nd
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23-03-2012, 09:54 PM

Behaviour Assessments.....

I've recently started watching a programme on Sky Living called RSPCA Animal Rescue based on the Australian RSPCA.

I used to really enjoy it, but have recently had to stop watching it due to the sheer amount of dogs PTS because they fail their behaviour assessments.

One dog was found as a stray and fed by the locals for several weeks. It was shown running around and playing with the local's dogs while still stray, but it was clearly terrified of people. When the RSPCA caught it and took it back to the shelter it was only given a few weeks in kennels to trust the staff to enable it to be rehomed. As such when they did the behaviour assessment it failed miserably as it was clearly petrified so they put the dog to sleep as it was deemed too risky to rehome! Am I the only one who thinks this attitude is appalling? I can't understand why the dog wasn't placed in foster with another dog for company to help gain it's trust.

Another dog was rescued from a neglectful owner and seemed very sweet. During it's behaviour assessment it showed anxious behaviour towards the life size doll they use to simulate a child. There was no aggression or fight response, just anxiety towards something it clearly wasn't sure about. The dog was PTS after this assessment as it was deemed to be too much of a risk to children.

I suppose it concerns me as Oscar can be an unpredictable dog around new situations, especially children, but I don't feel he's an unsuitable pet. More that he's a pet with special needs and as such needs special handling!

Is this what happens during behaviour assessments in the UK? Are they really that black and white?
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Hali
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23-03-2012, 10:04 PM
It depends.

In an ideal world there would be enough rescue places/foster places/forever home for every dog that needs it. (well actually ideally there wouldn't be the number of unwanted dogs in the first place). But when there aren't enough spaces, hard choices need to be made. If you only have kennel space for one dog, which do you keep - the one that needs work to be able to be rehomed or the one that can be rehomed immediately.

Of course I don't know exactly how the particular rescue you are talking about works, but I don't blame the rescues who do have to make these sorts of decisions - it isn't their fault that there are so many unwanted dogs.

Is it as bad in the UK - well it depends on the individual rescue. Many, particularly breed rescues, will spend considerable time rehabilating dogs. But at the end of the day, they all need to make tough decisions at some point.
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smokeybear
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23-03-2012, 10:30 PM
The harsh truth is that rescue and rehoming is governed by:

economics
resources
insurance policies
criminal law
civil law

There is not an infinite amount of finance available to rescue centres for lengthy rehabilitation.

There are not an infinite number of homes out there for rescue dogs, espeically those with issues.

There are not sufficient rehomers with the skills, knowledge, ability, training and experience to successfully home and rehab some dogs.

The legal and insurance aspects mean that the rescues have a duty of care to those who may be affected by their acts and/or omissions either directly or indirectly.

The amount of resources required to sucessfully rehab a difficult dog could be more wisely used to rehab 3 easy dogs.

And sadly not all dogs can be "made safe".

In the perfect world rescues would not be so prolific, every dog would have the time required to improve and the perfect home would be found for each individual.

Reality is very different.

What is more appalling, having a dog PTS because it has been identified as hazardous or keeping it alive, rehoming it and having it harm the adopters or other people.

I know what I would rather happened.
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chaospony
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23-03-2012, 11:59 PM
Originally Posted by smokeybear View Post
The harsh truth is that rescue and rehoming is governed by:

economics
resources
insurance policies
criminal law
civil law

There is not an infinite amount of finance available to rescue centres for lengthy rehabilitation.

There are not an infinite number of homes out there for rescue dogs, espeically those with issues.

There are not sufficient rehomers with the skills, knowledge, ability, training and experience to successfully home and rehab some dogs.

The legal and insurance aspects mean that the rescues have a duty of care to those who may be affected by their acts and/or omissions either directly or indirectly.

The amount of resources required to sucessfully rehab a difficult dog could be more wisely used to rehab 3 easy dogs.

And sadly not all dogs can be "made safe".

In the perfect world rescues would not be so prolific, every dog would have the time required to improve and the perfect home would be found for each individual.

Reality is very different.

What is more appalling, having a dog PTS because it has been identified as hazardous or keeping it alive, rehoming it and having it harm the adopters or other people.

I know what I would rather happened.
Exactly! I know what I would rather have happen too.
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Lizzy23
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24-03-2012, 06:43 AM
I've personally managed to bring round a few dogs that have been in last chance saloon, and to find them homes, having them here living with us as made it easier, i have also had dogs from kennel situations where they have been fine in the kennnels, but totally unpredictable in the home and visa versa.

Even in breed rescue, we don't have enough space for the amount of dogs that require spaces, and unfortunately in the current economic climate young dogs that a couple of years ago would have been straight in and straight out are hanging around.
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ClaireandDaisy
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24-03-2012, 09:20 AM
Very few of my dogs (maybe 2) past and present would have passed a behaviour assessment.
I think it has more to do with avoiding being sued than scientific evaluation because dogs behave so differently in different environments.
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nickmcmechan
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24-03-2012, 12:07 PM
Originally Posted by smokeybear View Post
There are not an infinite number of homes out there for rescue dogs, espeically those with issues.
Very true. I'm on rescue dog number 4 and every time it has came round to the decision to have another dog my wife and I always have the same discussion

"maybe we should get one from a breeder, we know what we will be getting and I do WT with them"

"but every time you buy from a breeder, a rescue goes without a home"

"but there's more risk with a rescue"

"if you don't take rescue your not getting one"

The Boss always wins......!
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ClaireandDaisy
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24-03-2012, 12:33 PM
The most challenging dog I ever had was straight from breeder.
The gentlest dog I ever had was a Rescue.
It doesn`t always follow that non-rescue dogs are a piece of cake, you know. In fact, if you think about it - all these dogs in Rescue come from a breeder in the first place.
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Tass
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25-03-2012, 12:03 AM
Originally Posted by ClaireandDaisy View Post
Very few of my dogs (maybe 2) past and present would have passed a behaviour assessment.
I think it has more to do with avoiding being sued than scientific evaluation because dogs behave so differently in different environments.
That is very true but you can only confirm a positive i.e. if a dog appears to present a problem in a situation there are ethical and legal concerns that it may also do so, or even escalate the problem in other situations, including those it may not have yet been able to be assessed in.

A dog that has exhibited a worrying or risky behaviour in one situation at the very least has experience and awareness of that behaviour.

Also as you say, these days everyone has to mind their backs about being sued, much easier to do so successfully when there was prior knowledge that a dog was known to show aggression, whatever the circumstances.

In terms of scientific evaluation, the more tests you have done, i.e. the larger your sample size, the better you get at reading what to other people may be insignificant or minor signs. Even when conducting an assessment there is a balance between how far someone takes the assessment and how much risk they expose themselves to.




The risks people choose to take with their own pets is a very different situation. As for the doll reaction, anxiety or nervousness are very common triggers for aggression and it would therefore be a high risk scenario.

I agree with SB that not all dogs can be saved or rehabilitated (anymore than all people can), although people tend to talk about their successes which can the misleading impression that they all can, if given enough time, effort and love.

Additionally, admitting to having dogs put down for behavioural reasons can be something of a rarely discussed taboo.
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Chris
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25-03-2012, 07:09 AM
The harsh reality is that there are far too many dogs and not enough homes available.

Another harsh reality is that we keep breeding more dogs into a world where there are not enough homes

We either turn the excess dogs out to fend for themselves, or we do what is happening now and that is to basically cull the excess stock

It's a sad, sad situation and one which will continue, unfortunately
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